passing of the guard

[david zawadzki]

If a bike has a new battery and a new starter but barely cranks over/ difficult for the bike to turn over would you suspect loose/tight valves? It does not want to start. What are symptoms of the timing not being properly set? Thanks guys- '96 DR350 electric start David

[Fred Hink]

Valve clearance or lack of should have no effect on the speed a starter turns over the engine. Ignition timing is usually set on most bikes with electronic ignition and is not adjustable. So this too should have no effect on starter speed. A loose or dirty connection will have an effect on starter speeds. Clean and tighten all your electrical connections between the battery and starter. This would include both the positive and negative sides of the battery, both terminals of the starter solenoid and your ground cable. I have seen new batteries fail, so be sure this battery is charged up to specs and operating properly before discounting the battery. Also if you got a rebuilt starter, they could also be at fault new out of the box. Has the bike sat for an appreciable length of time? Any chance of corrosion on the inside causing a drag on the starter? Check your voltage at the battery and then check the voltage at the starter once it is cranking. The voltage should be very similar. Good luck, Fred www.arrowheadmotorsports.com From: david zawadzki fordavidz@... [DSN_KLR650] Sent: Thursday, August 16, 2018 10:34 AM To: KLR Group Subject: [DSN_KLR650] Hard to Start - NON KLR If a bike has a new battery and a new starter but barely cranks over/ difficult for the bike to turn over would you suspect loose/tight valves? It does not want to start. What are symptoms of the timing not being properly set? Thanks guys- '96 DR350 electric start David [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[david zawadzki]

Thanks Fred. Will do. The battery is brand new so i will check the connections. I'll check back once I do. Any other ideas while I'm at it? David

On Thu, Aug 16, 2018 at 12:46 PM, Fred Hink moabmc@... [DSN_KLR650] DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com> wrote: [u][/u] Valve clearance or lack of should have no effect on the speed a starter turns over the engine. Ignition timing is usually set on most bikes with electronic ignition and is not adjustable. So this too should have no effect on starter speed. A loose or dirty connection will have an effect on starter speeds. Clean and tighten all your electrical connections between the battery and starter. This would include both the positive and negative sides of the battery, both terminals of the starter solenoid and your ground cable. I have seen new batteries fail, so be sure this battery is charged up to specs and operating properly before discounting the battery. Also if you got a rebuilt starter, they could also be at fault new out of the box. Has the bike sat for an appreciable length of time? Any chance of corrosion on the inside causing a drag on the starter? Check your voltage at the battery and then check the voltage at the starter once it is cranking. The voltage should be very similar. Good luck, Fred www.arrowheadmotorsports.com From: david zawadzki fordavidz@... [DSN_KLR650] Sent: Thursday, August 16, 2018 10:34 AM To: KLR Group Subject: [DSN_KLR650] Hard to Start - NON KLR If a bike has a new battery and a new starter but barely cranks over/ difficult for the bike to turn over would you suspect loose/tight valves? It does not want to start. What are symptoms of the timing not being properly set? Thanks guys- '96 DR350 electric start David [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

-- David Z mobile: 646-267-1109 poisonpartyband.com

[Martin Earl]

Thanks Fred for a great reply. As far as a "new battery"Even a new battery can 'fail' or be defective as new. Rare. but it happens. Make sure the outer case of the battery is not damaged or dented...a dented battery can push plates together and then will not operate properly. AMHIK.and just because it fits in the hole, does not mean it is the correct battery. Additionally to Fred's suggestions, the shop manual should show you how to electrically trouble shoot the amps/ohms flowing and resisting within the starter; even new starters can be bad. I have had that happen (on a car) as well. m

On Thu, Aug 16, 2018 at 11:18 AM, david zawadzki fordavidz@... [DSN_KLR650] DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com> wrote: Thanks Fred. Will do. The battery is brand new so i will check the connections. I'll check back once I do. Any other ideas while I'm at it? David On Thu, Aug 16, 2018 at 12:46 PM, Fred Hink moabmc@... [DSN_KLR650] DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com> wrote: [u][/u] Valve clearance or lack of should have no effect on the speed a starter turns over the engine. Ignition timing is usually set on most bikes with electronic ignition and is not adjustable. So this too should have no effect on starter speed. A loose or dirty connection will have an effect on starter speeds. Clean and tighten all your electrical connections between the battery and starter. This would include both the positive and negative sides of the battery, both terminals of the starter solenoid and your ground cable. I have seen new batteries fail, so be sure this battery is charged up to specs and operating properly before discounting the battery. Also if you got a rebuilt starter, they could also be at fault new out of the box. Has the bike sat for an appreciable length of time? Any chance of corrosion on the inside causing a drag on the starter? Check your voltage at the battery and then check the voltage at the starter once it is cranking. The voltage should be very similar. Good luck, Fred www.arrowheadmotorsports.com From: david zawadzki fordavidz@... [DSN_KLR650] Sent: Thursday, August 16, 2018 10:34 AM To: KLR Group Subject: [DSN_KLR650] Hard to Start - NON KLR If a bike has a new battery and a new starter but barely cranks over/ difficult for the bike to turn over would you suspect loose/tight valves? It does not want to start. What are symptoms of the timing not being properly set? Thanks guys- '96 DR350 electric start David [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

-- [color=#000000]David Z mobile: 646-267-1109 poisonpartyband.com [/color]

[Fred Hink]

Thanks Martin.  Nice of you to do that.  I feel lucky to have been in the motorcycle business back in the late 60s and early 70s as I do believe this was the Golden Era of motorcycling.  I have so many good memories of those times as it seems everyone had a motorcycle back then and it was an exciting time with all the new technology and new motorcycles being developed.  I was lucky enough to be working in a dealership that sold and serviced most all brands of bikes.  I was there to see the Japanese really bloom as a motorcycle nation and to see the fall of some European and American brands.  It was an exciting time for sure.    Truett & Osborn was a big part of the motorcycle community that I worked in.  There were three franchise dealerships and an accessory shop along with Truett  & Osborn all within a block of each other.  All the major brands were sold and serviced on this block.  I was amazed at the inventory of parts available in stock in the Parts Dept. of the shop I worked at.  Need a crankshaft?  no problem...  Need a second oversize piston for some obsolete bike, no problem.  They seemed to have everything.  The service department did all types of things from rebuilding crankshafts and heads, reboring cylinders, repainting bikes and repairing crash damages.  You don t find that in most bike shops today.   Truett & Osborn really pushed technology with their drag racing program.  If you needed to make a Harley Davidson faster you went to Truett & Osborn.   Fred http://www.arrowheadmotorsports.com   [b]From:[/b] DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com">Martin Earl mjearl4@... [DSN_KLR650] [b]Sent:[/b] Friday, August 17, 2018 10:36 PM [b]To:[/b] DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com">DSN KLR650 ; Buddy Eckles [b]Subject:[/b] Re: [DSN_KLR650] Passing of the Guard    

After reading Fred's OP, I went to the Sturgis MC Museum where Bonnie was inducted into the Hall of Fame (2014) and told them of his passing. The museum folks were aware and thanked me for checking to see they knew.   m1.   On Fri, Aug 17, 2018 at 3:52 PM, Buddy Eckles buddyeckles@... [DSN_KLR650] DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

Thanks for passing this on,Fred. Sent from my iPhone On Aug 17, 2018, at 5:56 AM, 'Fred Hink' moabmc@... [DSN_KLR650] DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com> wrote: It is sad when the old timers in our sport pass on.  I used to work near to Truett & Osborn in WIchita, KS back in the early 70s.  Being in the motorcycle business back then I had several opportunities to visit the Truett & Osborn shop.  Bonnie Truett was and is a legend in the motorcycle world.  Bonnie was a true innovator and his passing will be a great loss to most motorcyclists.  https://www.fmfsinc.com/ obituary-details?id=222   Ride on Bonnie Truett   Fred http://www. arrowheadmotorsports.com

 

[david zawadzki]

It's crazy. I just got a new maintenance free yusa battery. I charged it up with 750ma battery tender and it was only charging to 12.6v Bad charger?I found my friends battery tender that has an output of 1amp and it charged up to 13.3v. Let the bike sit for 1 hour and the voltage drops. I cranked the bike a few times and it dropped down to 12.6 and would not go up. The bike still didn't start. I cleaned all the electrical connections with a cleaner. Bad battery?

On Thu, Aug 16, 2018 at 2:17 PM, Martin Earl wrote: Thanks Fred for a great reply. As far as a "new battery"Even a new battery can 'fail' or be defective as new. Rare. but it happens. Make sure the outer case of the battery is not damaged or dented...a dented battery can push plates together and then will not operate properly. AMHIK.and just because it fits in the hole, does not mean it is the correct battery. Additionally to Fred's suggestions, the shop manual should show you how to electrically trouble shoot the amps/ohms flowing and resisting within the starter; even new starters can be bad. I have had that happen (on a car) as well. m On Thu, Aug 16, 2018 at 11:18 AM, david zawadzki fordavidz@... [DSN_KLR650] DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com> wrote: Thanks Fred. Will do. The battery is brand new so i will check the connections. I'll check back once I do. Any other ideas while I'm at it? David On Thu, Aug 16, 2018 at 12:46 PM, Fred Hink moabmc@... [DSN_KLR650] DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com> wrote: [u][/u] Valve clearance or lack of should have no effect on the speed a starter turns over the engine. Ignition timing is usually set on most bikes with electronic ignition and is not adjustable. So this too should have no effect on starter speed. A loose or dirty connection will have an effect on starter speeds. Clean and tighten all your electrical connections between the battery and starter. This would include both the positive and negative sides of the battery, both terminals of the starter solenoid and your ground cable. I have seen new batteries fail, so be sure this battery is charged up to specs and operating properly before discounting the battery. Also if you got a rebuilt starter, they could also be at fault new out of the box. Has the bike sat for an appreciable length of time? Any chance of corrosion on the inside causing a drag on the starter? Check your voltage at the battery and then check the voltage at the starter once it is cranking. The voltage should be very similar. Good luck, Fred www.arrowheadmotorsports.com From: david zawadzki fordavidz@... [DSN_KLR650] Sent: Thursday, August 16, 2018 10:34 AM To: KLR Group Subject: [DSN_KLR650] Hard to Start - NON KLR If a bike has a new battery and a new starter but barely cranks over/ difficult for the bike to turn over would you suspect loose/tight valves? It does not want to start. What are symptoms of the timing not being properly set? Thanks guys- '96 DR350 electric start David [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

-- [color=#000000]David Z mobile: 646-267-1109 poisonpartyband.com [/color] -- David Z mobile: 646-267-1109 poisonpartyband.com

[Harry Seifert]

OK, just how do you know that a dented battery will short out the plates?  Inquiring minds want to know. Buddy

On Aug 16, 2018, at 11:17 AM, Martin Earl mjearl4@... [DSN_KLR650] DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com> wrote: Thanks Fred for a great reply. As far as a "new battery"Even a new battery can 'fail' or be defective as new.  Rare. but it happens.Make sure the outer case of the battery is not damaged or dented...a dented battery can push plates together and then will not operate properly.  AMHIK.and just because it fits in the hole, does not mean it is the correct battery. Additionally to Fred's suggestions, the shop manual should show you how to electrically trouble shoot the amps/ohms flowing and resisting within the starter; even new starters can be bad. I have had that happen (on a car) as well.m On Thu, Aug 16, 2018 at 11:18 AM, david zawadzki fordavidz@... [DSN_KLR650] DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com> wrote: Thanks Fred. Will do. The battery is brand new so i will check the connections. I'll check back once I do. Any other ideas while I'm at it? David On Thu, Aug 16, 2018 at 12:46 PM, Fred Hink moabmc@... [DSN_KLR650] DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com> wrote: Valve clearance or lack of should have no effect on the speed a starter turns over the engine. Ignition timing is usually set on most bikes with electronic ignition and is not adjustable. So this too should have no effect on starter speed. A loose or dirty connection will have an effect on starter speeds. Clean and tighten all your electrical connections between the battery and starter. This would include both the positive and negative sides of the battery, both terminals of the starter solenoid and your ground cable. I have seen new batteries fail, so be sure this battery is charged up to specs and operating properly before discounting the battery. Also if you got a rebuilt starter, they could also be at fault new out of the box. Has the bike sat for an appreciable length of time? Any chance of corrosion on the inside causing a drag on the starter? Check your voltage at the battery and then check the voltage at the starter once it is cranking. The voltage should be very similar. Good luck, Fred www.arrowheadmotorsports.com From: david zawadzki fordavidz@... [DSN_KLR650] Sent: Thursday, August 16, 2018 10:34 AM To: KLR Group Subject: [DSN_KLR650] Hard to Start - NON KLR   

If a bike has a new battery and a new starter but barely cranks over/ difficult for the bike to turn over would you suspect loose/tight valves? It does not want to start. What are symptoms of the timing not being properly set? Thanks guys- '96 DR350 electric start David  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

--  David Zmobile: 646-267-1109poisonpartyband.com