heated gloves

DSN_KLR650
dumbazz_650
Posts: 201
Joined: Fri Sep 03, 2004 3:34 pm

water pump seal

Post by dumbazz_650 » Fri Dec 24, 2004 8:34 pm

Sounds like a manufacuring defect. The failure rate for water pump seals is pretty low, in my experience. Had a '97 with 20k miles on it that started leaking, but also had an '87 with 25k miles on it that had never leaked. I generally replace them after 25k miles or 5 years, whichever comes first. MarkB --- In DSN_klr650@yahoogroups.com, "kawa_klr650" wrote:
> > Hi there, > > Has anyone experienced problems with their water pump seal? On a > recent trip here in South Africa, I started losing coolant through > the little hole in the water pump. It was the water pump seal that > wasn't too happy and had to be replaced. Thanks to the extremely
poor
> service of Kawasaki here in South Africa, I was stuck for a week
in a
> town where the average temperature is 35 - 40 degrees in the
shade -
> and there is no shade! And that for a bike with just over 2000 > kilometers on the clock and still under warranty. > > Cheers. > > Abe

kdxkawboy@aol.com
Posts: 1442
Joined: Tue Jan 21, 2003 7:59 pm

water pump seal

Post by kdxkawboy@aol.com » Sat Dec 25, 2004 3:44 am

In a message dated 2004-12-24 12:46:57 PM Pacific Standard Time, abri.deswardt@... writes:
> > Has anyone experienced problems with their water pump seal? On a > recent trip here in South Africa, I started losing coolant through > the little hole in the water pump. It was the water pump seal that > wasn't too happy and had to be replaced. Thanks to the extremely poor > service of Kawasaki here in South Africa, I was stuck for a week in a > town where the average temperature is 35 - 40 degrees in the shade - > and there is no shade! And that for a bike with just over 2000 > kilometers on the clock and still under warranty. > > Cheers. > > Abe >
Abe, The only problem with the water pump seal that I am aware of would result from the using a coolant that has silicates (marketing speak for sand). In many motorcycle/diesel water pumps the silicates can cause premature wear of the seal. When this has been the case you can usually find scoring under the seal on the water pump shaft. Other than just bad luck, that is about the only thing I know of that can kill the water pump, that or letting your bike have unprotected sex with a rock. Pat G'ville, Nv [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

ron criswell
Posts: 1118
Joined: Fri Apr 07, 2000 5:09 pm

water pump seal

Post by ron criswell » Sat Dec 25, 2004 8:00 am

I have put 2 of them in. Some people say that if you add car type antifreeze, that can cause them to fail. Since using a bike specific antifreeze bought (and recommended) at a local Kawasaki shop, I have not had anymore trouble. Criswell kawa_klr650 wrote:
> Hi there, > > Has anyone experienced problems with their water pump seal? On a > recent trip here in South Africa, I started losing coolant through > the little hole in the water pump. It was the water pump seal that > wasn't too happy and had to be replaced. Thanks to the extremely poor > service of Kawasaki here in South Africa, I was stuck for a week in a > town where the average temperature is 35 - 40 degrees in the shade - > and there is no shade! And that for a bike with just over 2000 > kilometers on the clock and still under warranty. > > Cheers. > > Abe > > List sponsored by Dual Sport News at www.dualsportnews.com > List FAQ courtesy of Chris Krok at: www.bigcee.com/klr650faq.html > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > >

Stanford Johnsey
Posts: 67
Joined: Sat Jul 24, 2004 4:02 pm

water pump seal

Post by Stanford Johnsey » Sat Dec 25, 2004 8:06 am

An old wives tale. Car anti-freeze and brake fluid will also cause your clutch to slip. I have used green Prestone in every bike I have ever had and never had a seal failure. The current KLR650 has about 18,000 miles, all with Prestone and no problems. ron criswell wrote: I have put 2 of them in. Some people say that if you add car type antifreeze, that can cause them to fail. Since using a bike specific antifreeze bought (and recommended) at a local Kawasaki shop, I have not had anymore trouble. Criswell kawa_klr650 wrote:
> Hi there, > > Has anyone experienced problems with their water pump seal? On a > recent trip here in South Africa, I started losing coolant through > the little hole in the water pump. It was the water pump seal that > wasn't too happy and had to be replaced. Thanks to the extremely poor > service of Kawasaki here in South Africa, I was stuck for a week in a > town where the average temperature is 35 - 40 degrees in the shade - > and there is no shade! And that for a bike with just over 2000 > kilometers on the clock and still under warranty. > > Cheers. > > Abe > > List sponsored by Dual Sport News at www.dualsportnews.com > List FAQ courtesy of Chris Krok at: www.bigcee.com/klr650faq.html > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > >
List sponsored by Dual Sport News at www.dualsportnews.com List FAQ courtesy of Chris Krok at: www.bigcee.com/klr650faq.html Yahoo! Groups Links --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? All your favorites on one personal page Try My Yahoo! [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

kdxkawboy@aol.com
Posts: 1442
Joined: Tue Jan 21, 2003 7:59 pm

water pump seal

Post by kdxkawboy@aol.com » Sat Dec 25, 2004 10:29 am

In a message dated 2004-12-25 6:07:34 AM Pacific Standard Time, swjohnsey666@... writes:
> > > An old wives tale. Car anti-freeze and brake fluid will also cause your > clutch to slip. I have used green Prestone in every bike I have ever had and > never had a seal failure. The current KLR650 has about 18,000 miles, all with > Prestone and no problems. > >
Not an old wives tail, Honda absolutely states you cannot use silicate type coolants with their bikes. I learned about the problem through Motorcycle Consumer News - they had run a survey of Gold Wing owners and discovered something like 80% of the water pump problems had occurred shortly after replacing the coolant with automotive coolant, they contacted Honda and got the answer, why of course they failed, that's why we tell people not to use silicate based coolants and when MCN went back to the Honda manuals that is what was printed. At the time I read the article I'd just finished rebuilding the water pump on my KDX for the third time, flushed my coolant and put in Maxima coolant and that water pump held until I sold the bike several years later. I'd talked to the guys at the local shop and they where of the same mind being most the failed water pumps they worked on where in bikes using automotive coolants. so just for general principals I rebuilt the water pump on my KLR and found scoring on the shaft where the seal seats. Its the silicates getting caught under the seal that cause the problem. Pat G'ville, Nv [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Stanford Johnsey
Posts: 67
Joined: Sat Jul 24, 2004 4:02 pm

water pump seal

Post by Stanford Johnsey » Sat Dec 25, 2004 10:53 am

Last time I looked the KLR650 was made by Kawasaki, not Honda. The KLR650 came from the factory with ethelyne glycol based anti-freeze with a silicate based anti-corrosion (the best by far for aluminum) package. I'm sure that Kawasaki wouldn't use something that would harm their seals. This appears to be a Honda and probably GoldWing specific problem. kdxkawboy@... wrote: In a message dated 2004-12-25 6:07:34 AM Pacific Standard Time, swjohnsey666@... writes:
> > > An old wives tale. Car anti-freeze and brake fluid will also cause your > clutch to slip. I have used green Prestone in every bike I have ever had and > never had a seal failure. The current KLR650 has about 18,000 miles, all with > Prestone and no problems. > >
Not an old wives tail, Honda absolutely states you cannot use silicate type coolants with their bikes. I learned about the problem through Motorcycle Consumer News - they had run a survey of Gold Wing owners and discovered something like 80% of the water pump problems had occurred shortly after replacing the coolant with automotive coolant, they contacted Honda and got the answer, why of course they failed, that's why we tell people not to use silicate based coolants and when MCN went back to the Honda manuals that is what was printed. At the time I read the article I'd just finished rebuilding the water pump on my KDX for the third time, flushed my coolant and put in Maxima coolant and that water pump held until I sold the bike several years later. I'd talked to the guys at the local shop and they where of the same mind being most the failed water pumps they worked on where in bikes using automotive coolants. so just for general principals I rebuilt the water pump on my KLR and found scoring on the shaft where the seal seats. Its the silicates getting caught under the seal that cause the problem. Pat G'ville, Nv [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] List sponsored by Dual Sport News at www.dualsportnews.com List FAQ courtesy of Chris Krok at: www.bigcee.com/klr650faq.html Yahoo! Groups Links --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Send a seasonal email greeting and help others. Do good. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Conall
Posts: 534
Joined: Mon Feb 16, 2004 12:02 pm

heated gloves

Post by Conall » Sat Dec 25, 2004 12:19 pm

(Last time I bought) the Widder 'Lectric gloves are also plug-n-play with the same type of electrical connector that The Deltran battery tender utilizes. Unplug the gloves from the battery wiring harness, and plug in the battery tender when you park the cycle. Volla. warm hands and freshly charged KLR 650 battery. Conall --- In DSN_klr650@yahoogroups.com, "coo68ley" wrote:
> > Merry Christmas everybody... > > I got some heated gloves from Widder Enterprises for Christmas. I
commute to work on
> my KLR and the only heat related issue I have are my fingers going
numb every time. I
> usually deal with it until I can wrap my hands around that cup of
coffee at work, but no
> more. If you haven't tried these gloves yet, besides a Corbin seat
or something, they are
> an incredible mod that I reccommend to everyone. They run on 12
volts and connect
> straight to the battery. Now I look forward to riding in super
cold weather, whereas before
> I would take my car if it was too cold. > > Take it easy...

Conall
Posts: 534
Joined: Mon Feb 16, 2004 12:02 pm

water pump seal

Post by Conall » Sat Dec 25, 2004 1:35 pm

I have been unable to verify if KLRs are shipped with an antifreeze containing " silicate based anti-corrosion ". Personally I doubt it, it's probably a extended life , or non-silicate package . perhaps you could include the source of your information. I use the Maxima Coolanol. I like it because it is premixed 50/50, so it's ready to use right out of the bottle. Use of too strong of an antifreeze solution can hinder heat transfer from the engine, and promote silicate dropout. Pure water conducts heat better than antifreeze and corrosion inhibitor; therefore, the addition of antifreeze or other chemicals reduces the water's capacity to draw heat off the engine. So 50% antifreeze/ 50% soft or distilled water is the way to go. The problem with silicate coolants is they can potentially lead to silicate drop-out. When silicates present in antifreeze drop out, they build up and form a gel. A number of things can start this process: high silicate levels from incorrect antifreeze concentrations or improper use of coolant additives, impurities in very hard water, and severe engine temperature swings. "Boiler-scale" (calcium salts), especially present in used engines, present the largest threat of silicate dropout. Mixing incompatible types of silicate antifreezes can also lead to the coolant turning to gel. The main effects of the formation of this silicate gel are clogging of the heat exchanger, and engine overheating. Silicate gel buildup greatly reduces heat transfer to the coolant. When the gel coats the temperature sender, engine overheating can take place without notice. Silicate gel also carries abrasive particles to the water pump, where it wears away pump seals causing leakage and failure. I realize a lot of products are created and sold to satisfy peoples need for ego-gratification. People feel good about themselves when they spend money. But I really feel that the benefits of using silicant free coolants are real. That's my story and I'm sticking with it. Conall http://www.angelfire.com/co/klr650/coolant1.html --- In DSN_klr650@yahoogroups.com, Stanford Johnsey wrote:
> Last time I looked the KLR650 was made by Kawasaki, not Honda. The
KLR650 came from the factory with ethelyne glycol based anti-freeze with a silicate based anti-corrosion (the best by far for aluminum) package. I'm sure that Kawasaki wouldn't use something that would harm their seals. This appears to be a Honda and probably GoldWing specific problem.
> > kdxkawboy@a... wrote: > In a message dated 2004-12-25 6:07:34 AM Pacific Standard Time, > swjohnsey666@y... writes: > > > > > > > An old wives tale. Car anti-freeze and brake fluid will also
cause your
> > clutch to slip. I have used green Prestone in every bike I have
ever had and
> > never had a seal failure. The current KLR650 has about 18,000
miles, all with
> > Prestone and no problems. > > > > > > Not an old wives tail, Honda absolutely states you cannot use
silicate type
> coolants with their bikes. I learned about the problem through
Motorcycle
> Consumer News - they had run a survey of Gold Wing owners and
discovered something
> like 80% of the water pump problems had occurred shortly after
replacing the
> coolant with automotive coolant, they contacted Honda and got the
answer, why
> of course they failed, that's why we tell people not to use
silicate based
> coolants and when MCN went back to the Honda manuals that is what
was printed.
> > At the time I read the article I'd just finished rebuilding the
water pump on
> my KDX for the third time, flushed my coolant and put in Maxima
coolant and
> that water pump held until I sold the bike several years later. I'd
talked to
> the guys at the local shop and they where of the same mind being
most the
> failed water pumps they worked on where in bikes using automotive
coolants. so just
> for general principals I rebuilt the water pump on my KLR and found
scoring
> on the shaft where the seal seats. Its the silicates getting caught
under the
> seal that cause the problem. > > Pat > G'ville, Nv

kdxkawboy@aol.com
Posts: 1442
Joined: Tue Jan 21, 2003 7:59 pm

water pump seal

Post by kdxkawboy@aol.com » Sat Dec 25, 2004 5:29 pm

In a message dated 2004-12-25 11:36:24 AM Pacific Standard Time, klr650dotcc@... writes:
> > The main effects of the formation of this silicate gel are clogging > of the heat exchanger, and engine overheating. Silicate gel buildup > greatly reduces heat transfer to the coolant. When the gel coats the > temperature sender, engine overheating can take place without notice. > Silicate gel also carries abrasive particles to the water pump, where > it wears away pump seals causing leakage and failure. > > I realize a lot of products are created and sold to satisfy peoples > need for ego-gratification. People feel good about themselves when > they spend money. > But I really feel that the benefits of using silicant free coolants > are real. That's my story and I'm sticking with it. > > Conall >
Conall, thanks for the detailed explanation. Having rebuilt enough water [pumps with shaft's scored under the seal the moment I read the MCN article the light bulb went on. Know I understand the rest of the story. Pat G'ville, Nv [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

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