A Diesel engine will last far longer with a relatively even level of
emissions, whereas you can get the gasser to be cleaner initially but give
it 50K miles and it'll start to deteriorate faster, emission-wise. Over
300-400K miles, the Diesel will emit less.
Diesels now have uric acid injection and particular filters along with EGR
and catalyzers which makes them extremely clean.
The difference here is also in the PM10 emissions in a Diesel vs the PM1
emissions in a gasoline engine, and which one is more harmful to your lungs.
Ethanol is indeed bad juju from most estimates. Don't take it from me
though, I am no engineer, take it from the science geeks who do this for a
living (I actually interviewed for a job at NREL earlier this year as a
curious aside).
Anyway, the simplest way to put this is that it takes more energy to make
ethanol, than the ethanol contains. First, the ethanol can't be transported
like regular fuels (gasoline/Diesel etc) since it's hygroscopic. Thus we
need to burn fuel to transport it. Then the equipment to plow the fields and
farm the corn (which is indeed what we use here in the US, though sugarcane
and even potatoes could be used), then the fields where the corn is planted
is unusable for a while (can't even be used for other foods/crops). Then
the clincher is that it contains less BTUs than gasoline or Diesel. It's a
net energy loss, and at best, 15% lower in CO2 emissions.
Add in that the corn/sugar/potato used for ethanol is NOT used for food, and
it actually detracts from food supplies.
Here in Colorado we've seen a direct impact of that in Butterball (the
Turkey company) who laid off 400-500 people due to the cost of corn to feed
turkeys skyrocketing. According to their spokesman (in the local paper) it
was directly due to corn being used for ethanol.
Also, if you look at the cost of it, it's brutally expensive. No, you don't
see it at the pump, because it comes with large subsidies. Where does THAT
money come from? Ugly story.
Check Robert Rapier's energy blog for more details. You'll soon turn off
the idea of ethanol as a good thing.
As for old cars vs new cars, I think this article sums it up far better than
I can;
http://blog.wired.com/cars/2008/05/the-ultimate-pr.html
In short, a new car requires lots of energy to make!
As for wars - I don't know, we say that Germany was evil for invading a
bunch of countries and torturing people. I dunno, but check your local news
as of the last few years and see what WE have done. There's a reason
Americans aren't very well liked around the world. We could wield a big
stick when it comes to big things, but smaller domestic problems could be
left to the countries that insist on fighting over it.
From: Jokerloco9@... [mailto:Jokerloco9@...]
Sent: Sunday, October 05, 2008 18:36
To: reverend@...;
DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [DSN_KLR650] NKLR Energy independence is a crisis. Where's The
People's...
Just a few thoughts regarding your assertions:
Diesel is cleaner than gas? Are you sure? I know there have been major
inroads cleaning up diesel, but there are still issues.
Ethanol an environmental problem? Really? Alcohol burns cleaner than
diesel or gas. Do you still believe ethanol is going to be made from corn?
No one in the industry does. Check into the plant enginerering going on.
Like everything else, it needs a bit of development.
People buy a new car that is more polluting than a well tuned older car???
Uh, no. Just how old are you referring to? A couple of years, 20 perhaps?
A 25 year old car has about 1000 times the pollution of a new car. That is
no exageration. At least that is what my smog checks tell me. Compare the
numbers.
Stop supporting Isreal and Egypt? I'm with you on that, but the reality is
sitting on our butts and ignoring the outside world and all of the a**holes
out there is just what Europe did in the mid thirties. And what did we get
out of it? History refresher: Nazi Germany and WW2. This is the reason we
stick our noses in the outside world. Better to fight little wars then the
big one.
Jeff A20
In a message dated 10/5/2008 4:54:21 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time,
reverend@... writes:
We do have a few good things going for us. We have nuclear (safe,
inexpensive and something we can develop more. The nuclear waste - as long
as it's radioactive it contains energy, can that be harnessed?) and we have
oil.
Now, oil, despite the doom and gloomers spreading lies, isn't running out,
and like Europe (noticeable as I'm IN Europe right now) Diesel is a Damn
Good Thing. Granted, using less polluting sources of energy would be noble,
but at this point, we have few viable choices. I am no chemist, but I think
that propane and methane are among the few things less polluting than
Diesel. Gasoline isn't, but for some reason nobody likes the easy-to-refine
Diesel in the US.
Some alternatives would be to push a little more PV electricity for domestic
use. Prices are coming down so you can offset a good amount at home with
only a $20K ivestment. Nobody wants that either, since they rather buy a new
car (more polluting than many old ones kept in good shape).
We get special interest crap like Ethanol, that many people knew from the
start was a horribly moronic idea, particularly with the 'environmental'
aspect being the 'benefit'. Lobbyists make policy by essentially bribing
our "elected for the people by the people" politicians into harebrained
ideas.
It works - try to tell someone with a flexfuel car that he's f'ing up the
environment for the rest of us and see what happens!
An idea would be to stop with the treasonous support of Israel and Egypt,
stop foreign aid all together. Bring back the military and stop with
"strategic" military placement around the planet. Strengthen our borders and
bump up domestic manufacturing. We can buy oil with straight dollars
instead of oddball trades. We can make immigrants adhere to our way of life
instead of catering to theirs under the name of whatever freedoms they crave
(religious comes to mind.. hey, pray 5x a day if you wish, but if that
impacts your work performance, you get canned! - see Swift Manufacturing).
I guess I just figure that we are just on our knees servicing far too many
countries and people and neglecting our own kids, education, infrastructure
(I drove to Texas a while back and compared to the AUtoBahn, our freeways
are 4x4 tracks!!) It's embarrassing!
On the flip side, it's vanity that keeps us wanting to be on top of the food
chain. Even the dinosaurs died out, the planet didn't. Long after natural
events (or nuclear war) has made the planet unsustainable for humans, the
planet will still hum along fine. Maybe cockroaches will rule the planet?
Would that be so bad, other than out of human superiority vanity?
> -----Original Message-----
> Behalf Of boulder_adv_rider
>
> Folks, we need to rally together for energy independence. I can't
_____
New MapQuest Local shows what's happening at your destination. Dining,
Movies, Events, News & more. Try it out
http://local.mapquest.com/?ncid=emlcntnew00000001> !
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]