Wilsons Sandbox

"FINALLY" Someone who has something to say worth reading. monte quint wrote: Space program for pre-Moon trip USA resulted in a few institutions finding tne common ground to put aside their differences and cooperate on the goals of traveling the stars and reaching the moon. Government funding, industry desire to make a buck, academia all of a sudden were "rock stats" pushing the envelop in to science/math/physiology/pychology etc etc. Given a common goal these disciplines worked together on the USA's most grandiose project and that working together resulted in many advances which had little to do with actually going to space. The only thing you could get these various entities to agree on these days is that they have nothing in common. Spin-offs research from the space program has touched each and every person in the world. and made their life better. We innovate, the rest of the world duplicates. We need a massive innovation program today in the USA that will bring widely diverse groups together to work on our countries challenges. The largest program that ever successfully did that was the effort to put a man on the Moon. Not to mention that it was race among all the superpowers and for that reason alone the 50s-60s generation parents took their children out in to the dark night to stand and look uo at the stars and know that the tiny dot moving across the sky held a Russian, or a dog, or a US Astronaut. Once you saw people reach the stars it wasn't too hard to imagine that you could also and that any dream was really possible. No we do not need Mars Rocks, we need the results of those Moon rocks effort to be replicated though. Now we have so many un-cooperative groups pulling citizens in so many directions that many individuals won't participate because of the waste, the violent polarizing nature of some groups, the financial dishonesty we see, political stupidity, etc. Now lets start a really boring oil thread!!!!! yahoo!!! Monte List sponsored by Dual Sport News at: www.dualsportnews.com List FAQ courtesy of Chris Krok at: www.bigcee.com/klr650faq.html Member Map at: http://www.frappr.com/dsnklr650 Yahoo! Groups Links --------------------------------- Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Monte, I don't disagree that the space program has benefitted the common man, but I'd rather see us spend the billions here on Earth working to keep it habitable and for the U.S. to become energy independent. If the billions it will take to get to Mars (or the mega-billions we're borrowing from China to pish away in Iraq) were focused on creating enough clean energy to fuel America, many of our geo- political and environmental problems would disappear. Mars rocks won't do that. It's easier to rally the country around a space program than it is terrestrial developments because there are fewer vested interests to overcome (e.g., corn-based ethanol proponents, automakers, oil barons, a populous raised on oil) and it doesn't force Americans to make any changes to the lifestyles to which they feel entitled. Space programs are wonderful things, but I'll gladly forgo the next miracle adhesive to gain a sensible energy policy that puts the money necessary into research for future energy needs. Brazil doesn't have a space program, but they've pretty much quit importing oil thanks to a commitment to wean themselves from the black goo. Here's a company that seems to be going in the right direction with ethanol--using a cellulose-based process that takes all kinds of organic waste as inputs. http://www.rangefuels.com/ __Arden --- In DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com, "monte quint" wrote:

> > Space program for pre-Moon trip USA resulted in a few institutions > finding tne common ground to put aside their differences and > cooperate on the goals of traveling the stars and reaching the

moon.

> Government funding, industry desire to make a buck, academia all

of

> a sudden were "rock stats" pushing the envelop in to > science/math/physiology/pychology etc etc. > > Given a common goal these disciplines worked together on the USA's > most grandiose project and that working together resulted in many > advances which had little to do with actually going to space. > > The only thing you could get these various entities to agree on

these

> days is that they have nothing in common. > > Spin-offs research from the space program has touched each and

every

> person in the world. and made their life better. > > We innovate, the rest of the world duplicates. We need a massive > innovation program today in the USA that will bring widely diverse > groups together to work on our countries challenges. The largest > program that ever successfully did that was the effort to put a man > on the Moon. Not to mention that it was race among all the > superpowers and for that reason alone the 50s-60s generation

parents

> took their children out in to the dark night to stand and look uo

at

> the stars and know that the tiny dot moving across the sky held a > Russian, or a dog, or a US Astronaut. Once you saw people reach

the

> stars it wasn't too hard to imagine that you could also and that

any

> dream was really possible. > > No we do not need Mars Rocks, we need the results of those Moon

rocks

> effort to be replicated though. > > Now we have so many un-cooperative groups pulling citizens in so

many

> directions that many individuals won't participate because of the > waste, the violent polarizing nature of some groups, the financial > dishonesty we see, political stupidity, etc. > > Now lets start a really boring oil thread!!!!! yahoo!!! > > Monte >

While we're on the subject of energy, this just in from Washington: Senate Blocks Far-Reaching Energy Bill [snip] Environmental groups, consumer advocates and alternative-energy companies have hailed the bill, but a broad array of opponents, including cattlemen, coal producers and multinational oil companies, are lining up to block it. To: DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com From: arden646@... Date: Fri, 7 Dec 2007 15:24:32 +0000 Subject: [DSN_KLR650] Re: NKLR_Realllyyy again Monte, I don't disagree that the space program has benefitted the common man, but I'd rather see us spend the billions here on Earth working to keep it habitable and for the U.S. to become energy independent. If the billions it will take to get to Mars (or the mega-billions we're borrowing from China to pish away in Iraq) were focused on creating enough clean energy to fuel America, many of our geo- political and environmental problems would disappear. Mars rocks won't do that. It's easier to rally the country around a space program than it is terrestrial developments because there are fewer vested interests to overcome (e.g., corn-based ethanol proponents, automakers, oil barons, a populous raised on oil) and it doesn't force Americans to make any changes to the lifestyles to which they feel entitled. Space programs are wonderful things, but I'll gladly forgo the next miracle adhesive to gain a sensible energy policy that puts the money necessary into research for future energy needs. Brazil doesn't have a space program, but they've pretty much quit importing oil thanks to a commitment to wean themselves from the black goo. Here's a company that seems to be going in the right direction with ethanol--using a cellulose-based process that takes all kinds of organic waste as inputs. http://www.rangefuels.com/ __Arden --- In DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com, "monte quint" wrote:

> > Space program for pre-Moon trip USA resulted in a few institutions > finding tne common ground to put aside their differences and > cooperate on the goals of traveling the stars and reaching the

moon.

> Government funding, industry desire to make a buck, academia all

of

> a sudden were "rock stats" pushing the envelop in to > science/math/physiology/pychology etc etc. > > Given a common goal these disciplines worked together on the USA's > most grandiose project and that working together resulted in many > advances which had little to do with actually going to space. > > The only thing you could get these various entities to agree on

these

> days is that they have nothing in common. > > Spin-offs research from the space program has touched each and

every

> person in the world. and made their life better. > > We innovate, the rest of the world duplicates. We need a massive > innovation program today in the USA that will bring widely diverse > groups together to work on our countries challenges. The largest > program that ever successfully did that was the effort to put a man > on the Moon. Not to mention that it was race among all the > superpowers and for that reason alone the 50s-60s generation

parents

> took their children out in to the dark night to stand and look uo

at

> the stars and know that the tiny dot moving across the sky held a > Russian, or a dog, or a US Astronaut. Once you saw people reach

the

> stars it wasn't too hard to imagine that you could also and that

any

> dream was really possible. > > No we do not need Mars Rocks, we need the results of those Moon

rocks

> effort to be replicated though. > > Now we have so many un-cooperative groups pulling citizens in so

many

> directions that many individuals won't participate because of the > waste, the violent polarizing nature of some groups, the financial > dishonesty we see, political stupidity, etc. > > Now lets start a really boring oil thread!!!!! yahoo!!! > > Monte >

_________________________________________________________________ Share life as it happens with the new Windows Live.Download today it's FREE! http://www.windowslive.com/share.html?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_Wave2_sharelife_112007 [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Wow, that was selective text snippage there! Also included in the bill and hotly contested are: -- Mandatory ethanol use -- CAFE increase to 35mpg by year 2020 -- Mandated 15% renewable resource energy for utility companies Most of the costs of this will of course fall on the backs of the taxpayers - which is us. Much of what's in the bill sounds good, but when our government (red state, blue state, doesn't matter) forces us into something by making laws, it usually doesn't quite work the way it was intended. jt5231@... wrote:

> > > > While we're on the subject of energy, this just in from Washington: > > Senate Blocks Far-Reaching Energy Bill > > [snip] > Environmental groups, consumer advocates and alternative-energy > companies have hailed the bill, but a broad array of opponents, > including cattlemen, coal producers and multinational oil companies, > are lining up to block it. > > >

Yeah But we never went to the moon those pictures and film were taken on a sound stage. :p And if you say that within ear shot of Buzz Adrin He'll punch you in the face, he's done it before.

--- In DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com, "albatrossklr" wrote: > > I am an advocate of the space program, not for the new products that > result, but to keep the adventure alive. > > albatross > who would take a 1 way ticket to Mars if I could be the first... >