Wilsons Sandbox

Following this thread has provided some interesting reading. Eric Green has managed to inculcate some of the non-believers with his erudite descriptions of the complicated physics involved in the whole matter. Some, however, seem to have trouble getting past the initial skepticism so that they can even begin to understand his explanations. May I suggest this little graphic demonstration: Find a friend who has a similar curiosity concerning counter- steering, and take your bikes to a road with little traffic and a painted center line. Take turns riding on, or next to, the center line. It only needs to serve as a reference point. The rider of the leading bike should go straight for 50 feet or so, then initiate a turn toward the right hand side of the pavement. The observer following behind will notice that before the bike begins to turn to the right the bottom of the tire will move to the left, initiating the lean, and thus the turn, to the right. That is countersteering. Try to turn right without letting the bottom of the tire move left first. At any speed over about 15 mph (depends on the bike) you can't do it. Countersteering around a tight curve: Check out (again) this photo - http://www.amasuperbike.com/adm/upl/584yc7mpc6_1088447132.jpg If either of those two leading bikes turned the handlebars to the right (in this right hand curve) they would not be turning right - they would be turning DOWN into the pavement, leaned over as they are. As Eric pointed out, the desire for a front tire of the size seen on such motorcycles to turn around its axis is so great that it takes a steady countersteering effort to keep the bike leaned over. Otherwise the tire wants to get back under the bike and straighten it up. Okay, back to lurking and reading. Jack, Glennallen, Alaska (soon to be KLR owner - I hope)

> Countersteering around a tight curve: Check out (again) > this photo - > > http://www.amasuperbike.com/adm/upl/584yc7mpc6_1088447132.jpg > > If either of those two leading bikes turned the handlebars > to the right (in this right hand curve) they would not be > turning right - they would be turning DOWN into the > pavement, leaned over as they are.

Huh? Did you mean to type that? I say they would straighten up.

> As Eric pointed out, the desire for a front tire of the size > seen on such motorcycles to turn around its axis is so great > that it takes a steady countersteering effort to keep the bike > leaned over. Otherwise the tire wants to get back under the > bike and straighten it up.

I don't think so. Depends on your tire's profile. Could be that way, could be neutral, could be the reverse. MrMoose A8 (Barbie and Ken special)

In a message dated 2004-12-14 10:28:52 PM Pacific Standard Time, k.saltzer@... writes:

> >Countersteering around a tight curve: Check out (again) > >this photo - > > > >http://www.amasuperbike.com/adm/upl/584yc7mpc6_1088447132.jpg > > > >If either of those two leading bikes turned the handlebars > >to the right (in this right hand curve) they would not be > >turning right - they would be turning DOWN into the > >pavement, leaned over as they are. > > > Huh? Did you mean to type that? I say they would straighten up. > >

If the limited the movement to countersteering they bike would straighten up and possibly high side if the fail to roll on the throttle to use this standing up to complete the turn, and then brake like hell. If they went beyond subtle countersteer movement then the front wheel while start pointing towards the pavement causing the front to slide out and creating a low side. This could be a semantical draw. Pat G'ville, Nv [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

> > All the rotor bolt does is hold the rotor onto the end of the > crankshaft, I don't think a few foot pounds either way will make a > darn bit of difference.

The spacers behind the one way clutch gear somehow got pitted and thus compromised in my A9. Something, I'm told, not uncommon in that model. The first time this was noticed we sanded them and everything was fine. The last time I had this stuff apart was - luckily - at a tech session at Fred's in Moab. When, after replacing the broken spring, I put everything back together the rotor/gear wouldn't turn properly and made a frightening racket. Tim Bernard and Mike Colishaw, doohickey tech session veterans, were in attendance. They had encountered this before. After sanding filing the spacers we reinstalled the parts but this time only torqued to 100 lb/ft. I've had no problems with the system. This time, at least, you're absolutely right, Stu. Bogdan