nklr - care and feeding of carbureted bikes

[fasteddiecopeman]

Hey Guys, I got back from my Alaska and NWT trip yesterday (I'll have the story and pics in a bit...) and I have a problem I need some help with. My temp gauge began acting up - it would go slowly (at first) to full hot, then move from max to just below, and when I would re-start after a stop, it would go right to full hot as soon as I turned the key ON. Even after being engine OFF overnight it would go max when the ignition 's turned ON, and it would "dance" around the full hot position (did NOT notice the fan come on more often than usual, so I basically treated it as an indication problem after I rinsed dust out of the rad and checked antifreeze level). I figure it's EITHER the temperature sending unit (I believe on the head near the spark plug?) or the gauge itself. Anyone heard of this happening? Jeff? Bill? Cheers, Ed

[stevedyer@cox.net]

Ed, I saw the temp gauge on Roy Neary's F150 do the same thing when an alien spacecraft was hovering right above him by the railroad tracks. You haven't had any run-ins with aliens lately, have you? Steve in Norman, OK A13, with the only recent close encounters being the deep muddy creek kind. ------- ---- fasteddiecopeman wrote: Hey Guys, I got back from my Alaska and NWT trip yesterday (I'll have the story and pics in a bit...) and I have a problem I need some help with. My temp gauge began acting up - it would go slowly (at first) to full hot, then move from max to just below, and when I would re-start after a stop, it would go right to full hot as soon as I turned the key ON. Even after being engine OFF overnight it would go max when the ignition 's turned ON, and it would "dance" around the full hot position (did NOT notice the fan come on more often than usual, so I basically treated it as an indication problem after I rinsed dust out of the rad and checked antifreeze level). I figure it's EITHER the temperature sending unit (I believe on the head near the spark plug?) or the gauge itself. Anyone heard of this happening? Jeff? Bill? Cheers, Ed ------------------------------------ List sponsored by Dual Sport News at: www.dualsportnews.com List FAQ courtesy of Chris Krok at: www.bigcee.com/klr650faq.html Member Map at: http://www.frappr.com/dsnklr650Yahoo! Groups Links

[Tumu Rock]

--- In DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com, "fasteddiecopeman" wrote:

> > My temp gauge began acting up - it would go slowly (at first) to full hot, then move from max to just below, and when I would re-start after a stop, it would go right to full hot as soon as I turned the key ON. Even after being engine OFF overnight it would go max when the ignition 's turned ON, and it would "dance" around the full hot position (did NOT notice the fan come on more often than usual, so I basically treated it as an indication problem after I rinsed dust out of the rad and checked antifreeze level). > > I figure it's EITHER the temperature sending unit (I believe on the head near the spark plug?) or the gauge itself. Anyone heard of this happening? Jeff? Bill? > > Cheers, > > Ed >

Eddie, I think you're on the right track. It could be as simple as a short in the wire to/from the temp sending unit. I had a similar problem on my KTM and, lucky for me, it was just the wire itself had come loose. Good luck, da Vermonster

[Kurt Grife]

I had a similar problem and traced it to a ground wire, the small ground wire (black/yellow) that goes to the battery negative terminal was loose at the bullet connector near the battery. It also caused other strange problems like the headlight getting brighter when I used the brakes and the tach was erratic. All went away when I cleaned the connector and put it firmly back together.

--- In DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com, "fasteddiecopeman" wrote: > > Hey Guys, > > I got back from my Alaska and NWT trip yesterday (I'll have the story and pics in a bit...) and I have a problem I need some help with. > > My temp gauge began acting up - it would go slowly (at first) to full hot, then move from max to just below, and when I would re-start after a stop, it would go right to full hot as soon as I turned the key ON. Even after being engine OFF overnight it would go max when the ignition 's turned ON, and it would "dance" around the full hot position (did NOT notice the fan come on more often than usual, so I basically treated it as an indication problem after I rinsed dust out of the rad and checked antifreeze level). > > I figure it's EITHER the temperature sending unit (I believe on the head near the spark plug?) or the gauge itself. Anyone heard of this happening? Jeff? Bill? > > Cheers, > > Ed >

[Craig Kahler]

I had a similar problem on a KLR 250. It was caused by a wiring connector behind the faring coming loose. Craig Kahler

--- On Mon, 7/27/09, Kurt Grife wrote: From: Kurt Grife Subject: [DSN_KLR650] Re: temp - overheat problems... To: DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com Date: Monday, July 27, 2009, 6:23 PM I had a similar problem and traced it to a ground wire, the small ground wire (black/yellow) that goes to the battery negative terminal was loose at the bullet connector near the battery. It also caused other strange problems like the headlight getting brighter when I used the brakes and the tach was erratic. All went away when I cleaned the connector and put it firmly back together. --- In DSN_KLR650@yahoogro ups.com, "fasteddiecopeman" wrote: > > Hey Guys, > > I got back from my Alaska and NWT trip yesterday (I'll have the story and pics in a bit...) and I have a problem I need some help with. > > My temp gauge began acting up - it would go slowly (at first) to full hot, then move from max to just below, and when I would re-start after a stop, it would go right to full hot as soon as I turned the key ON. Even after being engine OFF overnight it would go max when the ignition 's turned ON, and it would "dance" around the full hot position (did NOT notice the fan come on more often than usual, so I basically treated it as an indication problem after I rinsed dust out of the rad and checked antifreeze level). > > I figure it's EITHER the temperature sending unit (I believe on the head near the spark plug?) or the gauge itself. Anyone heard of this happening? Jeff? Bill? > > Cheers, > > Ed > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Jeff Saline]

On Mon, 27 Jul 2009 21:24:59 -0000 "fasteddiecopeman" writes:

> Hey Guys, > > I got back from my Alaska and NWT trip yesterday (I'll have the > story and pics in a bit...) and I have a problem I need some help > with. > > My temp gauge began acting up - it would go slowly (at first) to > full hot, then move from max to just below, and when I would > re-start after a stop, it would go right to full hot as soon as I > turned the key ON. Even after being engine OFF overnight it would go > max when the ignition 's turned ON, and it would "dance" around the > full hot position (did NOT notice the fan come on more often than > usual, so I basically treated it as an indication problem after I > rinsed dust out of the rad and checked antifreeze level). > > I figure it's EITHER the temperature sending unit (I believe on the > head near the spark plug?) or the gauge itself. Anyone heard of this > happening? Jeff? Bill? > > Cheers, > > Ed

<><><><><><><><> <><><><><><><><> Ed, I seem to recall you have an 08. Is that correct? If so I also seem to recall hearing about the temperature sending wire sometime touching something around the head and melting insulation causing incorrect temperature readings at the gauge. So I guess I'd start with a peek at the temp sender wire to see if it's got issues. I'd probably start with a flashlight and peek past the sparkplug. If that didn't show anything I'd remove the tank and take a better peek. Best, Jeff Saline ABC # 4412 South Dakota Airmarshal Airheads Beemer Club www.airheads.org The Beautiful Black Hills of South Dakota 75 R90/6, 03 KLR650, 79 R100RT . ____________________________________________________________ You will believe your eyes! Click here for great whale watching packages! http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2141/fc/BLSrjpTJ2qcu2tf0a9FznKCqCn4U8iRqMzQIl8YTp0fXl7N6LIo3iTa5NeQ/

[transalp 1]

The temperature wire can contact the exhaust recirculation plumbing, yes? I seem to remember a wire nearby when I had everything apart for the valve inspection on my 09' .- other eddie

> [Original Message] > From: Jeff Saline > To: > Cc: DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com> > Date: 7/28/2009 12:34:55 AM > Subject: Re: [DSN_KLR650] temp - overheat problems... > > On Mon, 27 Jul 2009 21:24:59 -0000 "fasteddiecopeman" > writes: > > Hey Guys, > > > > I got back from my Alaska and NWT trip yesterday (I'll have the > > story and pics in a bit...) and I have a problem I need some help > > with. > > > > My temp gauge began acting up - it would go slowly (at first) to > > full hot, then move from max to just below, and when I would > > re-start after a stop, it would go right to full hot as soon as I > > turned the key ON. Even after being engine OFF overnight it would go > > max when the ignition 's turned ON, and it would "dance" around the > > full hot position (did NOT notice the fan come on more often than > > usual, so I basically treated it as an indication problem after I > > rinsed dust out of the rad and checked antifreeze level). > > > > I figure it's EITHER the temperature sending unit (I believe on the > > head near the spark plug?) or the gauge itself. Anyone heard of this > > happening? Jeff? Bill? > > > > Cheers, > > > > Ed > <><><><><><><><> > <><><><><><><><> > > Ed, > > I seem to recall you have an 08. Is that correct? > > If so I also seem to recall hearing about the temperature sending wire > sometime touching something around the head and melting insulation > causing incorrect temperature readings at the gauge. > > So I guess I'd start with a peek at the temp sender wire to see if it's > got issues. I'd probably start with a flashlight and peek past the > sparkplug. If that didn't show anything I'd remove the tank and take a > better peek. > > Best, > > Jeff Saline > ABC # 4412 South Dakota Airmarshal > Airheads Beemer Club www.airheads.org > The Beautiful Black Hills of South Dakota > 75 R90/6, 03 KLR650, 79 R100RT >

[Jeff Khoury]

Excellent. Great Idea and I'll add it to the article. I will probably add leaving the drain screws open as an option, but for myself I will probably close them. I just KNOW I would forget, turn on the petcock and find myself with gas all over the place! -Jeff Khoury Astatic Solutions, LLC.

----- Original Message ----- From: "Rick McCauley" To: "dsn klr650" dsn_klr650@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Tuesday, July 28, 2009 10:58:17 AM GMT -08:00 US/Canada Pacific Subject: Re: [DSN_KLR650] NKLR - Care and feeding of carbureted bikes Excellent advice. If i may, I would like to add to Step #2. Once the carb(s) is drained, I like to stick the skinny red tube thingy, that comes with carb cleaner, up the hose you used to drain the carbs. Spray carb cleaner in thru the hose until you are sure the bowl has had a good flushing. Allow the carb cleaner to drain back out. It gives me the added certainty that i am keeping my carb clean. Also, a mechanic told me it was best to leave the drain screws open for storage. Any feedback on that? Rick A17 --- On Tue, 7/28/09, Jeff Khoury < jeff@... > wrote: From: Jeff Khoury < jeff@... > Subject: [DSN_KLR650] NKLR - Care and feeding of carbureted bikes To: "DSN KLR650" < DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com > Date: Tuesday, July 28, 2009, 12:42 PM Good Morning All, I know this info is probably old news to most people on this list, but I'm writing a series of motorcycle maintenance and repair articles on my blog. These started out as posts to this and other lists and the thought occurred to me that I should collect my old posts, clean them up and post them so I didn't have to keep-rewriting them all the time. I though I'd post this one here for peer review (Please be gentle). The articles to follow will be about carburetor theory, cleaning, rebuilding and jetting then probably moving on to other topics. Feedback is always welcome. Care and feeding of your carbureted motorcycle: Among the most common problems that people have with their motorcycles are plugged jets and passageways in the carburetor(s) . This clogging is caused by varnish that accumulates over time due to the evaporation of the gasoline in the bowls and passageways of the carb. The varnish consists of gasoline additives, and here in California we have more additives in our gas than just about anywhere in the country. To prevent this, there are some very simple steps you can take to save yourself time and/or money with carburetor problems. I will give several methods in order of preference to keep the varnish from forming: Method #1: Ride your motorcycle This one is the easiest and most fun. Riding your motorcycle often (every few days at least) will keep fresh gasoline in the carburetor bowls and will prevent the gas in the tank from going sour over time. Riding your motorcycle also has the added side benefit of reducing stress and generally having a good time. Method #2: Drain your carb(s) if you plan to store your motorcycle for more than a week. Draining your carbs is easy and the best way to keep varnish from forming. On most bikes, all you need is a short length of rubber tubing, a screwdriver and a small bottle. On the bottom of most carbs, you will see a small nipple on the very bottom of the bowl, and there will be a valve screw in the bowl as well. Turn off the fuel petcock* (see below), then simply put one end of the tube on the nipple, the other in the bottle and loosen the screw a bit. A small amount of gas will drain into your bottle from each bowl. Tighten the screw when you're done, and be careful not to over-tighten. When you've drained them all, pour the gas back in to the tank, not on the ground or sewer, please. When it comes time to start your bike, turn on your fuel, wait a minute or two for the bowls to fill and crank away. Depending on the type of fuel delivery, it may take quite a bit of cranking to start, especially if you have a vacuum-powered fuel pump. Gravity-fed bikes and MOST bikes with electric fuel pumps usually start right up. Method #3: Run your carbs dry. This method is not as preferable as draining, but it will help significantly to extend the length of time between carburetor rebuilds. The process is simple, but cannot be performed on a bike with a vacuum-controlled petcock. Turn the petcock to [off] and start the bike. Hold the throttle open to about 1/4 throttle to ensure that the main jets are active. This draws fuel from a lower part of the bowl than the pilot (idle) jets and will remove more fuel from the bowls. There will still be some fuel left and varnish will form in the bottom of the bowls, but at least it won't be on the jets. Method #4: Use a fuel stabilizer This is the least-preferred method, but it's better than nothing. Use the recommended amount of "Sta-bil" or "Sea Foam" fuel additives that will retard varnish formation. Make sure you add it to the tank and ride a few miles to make sure that it makes it down into the bowls from the tank, and make sure your petcock is off. Long-term storage: If you plan to store your bike for more than a month, drain the tank in addition to the carburetors. Over time, the same evaporation happens in the tank and can varnish your tank and fill it with sediment. Even longer periods of storage can make the gas in the tank unusable sickly-sweet smelling sludge. The time you take draining it can save hours of work cleaning and rebuilding your fuel system. * There are two types of fuel petcocks: standard and vacuum-controlled. The standard ones are marked [on - off - res]. The vacuum-controlled ones are typically marked [on - pri - res]. If you have a vacuum-controlled petcock, the fuel is only turned on when vacuum is applied via a second hose from one of the intakes when in the [on] or [res] positions. [Pri] stands for "Prime" and is the equivalent of [res] on standard petcocks. -Jeff Khoury [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Bill Watson]

Jeff, Ed actually has an '04. Ed, your test of pegging the gauge right after turning the key on in the morning was a great one. Seems like it's either the sensor (yes, right next to the spark plug) or the wiring. When the wire sees no resistance, the gauge reads its highest. I haven't seen a sensor go bad like that so I'd sure be watching the wiring and grounds as others have recommended. Otherwise you could also check the sensor's resistance with the bike at room temperature. I can dig up the ohm reading expected in the meantime. If you find no resistance in the sensor with the engine cold (say, under 5 ohms) I'd be looking for a new sensor. Bill [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]